And Eklipse calling me a "Fascist" for supporting separation of church and state fits in "civilized discussion" how, exactly?

Don't twist my words around. I didn't directly call you a Fascist. I said it's a Fascist position to automatically assume one view superior to the other when nobody knows for sure about either. I attacked your stance, not you. So don't cry about "Uncivilized".

Also, you're the same guy who's primary response included "Fuck you" in a thread regarding secession, so it's rather hypocritical of you to implicate me of being uncivil.

You just have to embrace the reality that this section of the site is filled with trolls and people who're so ignorant yet confident they might as well be trolls. This is why it's much more fun to actually play the game instead of trying to eke out a social environment in this graveyard of the intellect.

And you're so much better than everyone here, am I right? Seriously, knyte. I might actually like you if you didn't carry such a feeling of arrogance and superiority around with you. If what you say is true, why don't you take that superior intellect and post somewhere else? Don't want to waste it on degenerates after all.

I'm sorry if this comes off as a personal rant against you, but I've seen enough. Almost every single topic you post in you take to degrading large numbers of people simply for the fact that they aren't like you in some fashion. I've tried to keep polite about things but there's only so much arrogance one can take.

Your political views aren't any more valid than anyone else's. So why don't you try to just discuss something without broadly demonizing large groups of users?

Yes, there are trolls here, but not as many as you think, and not by your loose definition of them.

Edit: Special apology to Genghis if this derails his thread, but it's high time someone stood up to knyte and his demeaning attitude.

Edited 9/2/2015 14:25:12

#shotsfired #sorrynotsorry

I was in High School before this new clothing movement, and the girls still seemed to get away with wearing less than the guys did.

US, 9th Grade

1. What are your thoughts on standardized testing? Good or bad? Why so?
Good, allows standards to be promulgated. Needs to be done carefully, so as not to cause a CC (In my opinion, CC has been really dumbed down. Either that, or I've seen some awful dumbness as a schoolkid)

2. What are your thoughts on special needs education? Good or bad? Why so?
I'm not special needs. I can't really comment here. If you are asking if they should be integrated with the traditional schooling, I'd have to say no here. (There's a mentally disabled kid at my school, and unfortunately, I've had to come to the belief that dumbness is contagious)

3. Do you feel Sexual education is an important class? Do you feel it should be improved, stay the same or be removed?
It's necessary for some kids (Read: One girl who pestered me for being a nerd, and knowing all of this stuff (you know why). She wanted to have kids as soon as she got out of highschool. She knew jack about the reproductive system) . Not all though. Nerds (like me, but unlike me) get really flustered regarding sexual education. Most of us know it, but it's still quite touchy, like your mom. ;)

4. Do you think we should teach more general subjects? A "prepare you for life" class, basically.
Like Vocational teaching? No, in that case. It should only be for people who request it. Although, I do think that some people should go to it.

5. Do you think the maths classes are important, and if so, important for what? Are they good,bad? Do they need improvement et al?
Yes, life as someone with a steady job that will pay decently. I believe that we must make it more rigorous, but easier, if you get what I mean.

6. What are your thoughts on the current state of Social studies classes? Do you think they are doing a good job?
They don't talk about stuff in detail. I <3 detail. That's why I left. I wanted my world (read Qwedland) to have decent detailage, like GoT. They do do a decent job, but overwhelmingly focus on major civilizations, and not the details behind them.

7. What are your thoughts on language classes? Good or bad ? Need improvement?
Bad teachers = bad class. Good teacher = Good class. Personally, my school changed the curriculum for 8th grade to be "cultural" versus "language-based", so it was really boring. Also, they need to add more interesting languages, not just romance languages.

8. Do you think evolution theory should be taught in schools? If so, what about creationism? What other theories?
Yes evolution, no cintelligent designism. Abiogenesis should be taught to some extent, like the main theories, and concepts, like the formation of DNA, but not other stuff. Panspermia and its opposite should not be taught.

9. Do you think the social environment in public school is great? Do you find it lacking? Should it exist at all?
Not really lacking. I don't care much for it though

10. What are your thoughts on the extracurricular activities? Such as art, chorus, orchestra, JROTC, Sports, or Shop class. Do some need to leave? Do others need improvement?
I'm not in any of them. Unless you count AP Comp Sci

11. What are some classes you'd like to see?
I'm not really sure. Other than languages other than Romance languages, I'd have to say none.

nobody knows for sure about either

Eklipse, we might as well be teaching alternative explanations to gravity. Evolution is a well-attested scientific theory (and a scientific theory is, by definition, a hypothesis that has a ridiculously strong substantiation base). We know with virtual certainty that humans and modern chimpanzees, for example, share a common ancestor- there is more evidence for that than you could fit into 4 years of university. It could even be argued that evolution is better evidenced than gravity.

Furthermore, evolution is essentially the grand unifying theory of biology- everything in the field only makes sense in the context of evolution. Every organ, every organism, every behavior- from the most basic (Why do most species have a 50-50 male to female ratio? The Fisher principle- an application of evolutionary game theory) to the most complex (How did humans develop language?)- makes sense only in light of evolution.

The science is nowhere near ambiguous. Evolution is not on the same level as a religious explanation that's demonstrably false.

Feel free to argue that. There are literally billions- if not more- pieces of evidence that could be used to challenge any unscientific claim you're willing to throw at me in defense of creationism/intelligent design.

And this is not my opinion or my personal view, but the scientific consensus supported by virtually the entire corpus of biological research and backed by over 99% of people who're most qualified to speak on the subject. There is nothing close to a debate here.

That said, I apologize for calling a troll. It appears your views are simply a result of ignorance here, so- in YouTube format- here's a short list of explanations for why evolutionary theory is more than just some random ramblings from an old British guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqxCoibTtaI

It's a little bit disheartening that the subject is so poorly taught because its science is inconvenient for some religious fundamentalists, so- I guess, in good faith- I can point you to any sources you'd like to read up on the subject. I'm not a biologist in any sense, but I'm well-read on the subject (hey, enjoying science- even the softer stuff- is part of being an engineer, right?) and should be able to help out- even if just a little bit.

Edited 9/2/2015 19:25:25

I'm practically PhD on classical antiquity history and world geography.

Don't overestimate yourself - firstly, you haven't been to university on history (nor should you) or geography. Secondly, have you ever spent time in an archive or dig? Not fun, but need to know stuff for phD. Thirdly, I can confirm that your historic knowledge itself is not meriting of a phD.

I've had folk who (claim to) are be 1 year short of 4 in university, studying history, mistake me for a phD, but I don't think this makes me a phD, nor skilled enough to be one (at archives, diggings, or historic knowledge).

^ Agree with Kapy. It's easy to overestimate how much you know about a subject when you know very little about it. Every first-semester engineering student thinks they're already ready to start building the next Ferrari, every first-semester pre-med starts diagnosing their cat (or themselves) with things they don't have, etc.

Exaggeration
noun

A statement that represents something worse or better than it really is.

I'd say I'm definitely not PhD on geography, but people mistake my general intelligence for Classical antiquity history for arrogance. That said, I am currently interested in learning some Asian antiquity history, I'm also trying to memorize the Mediterranean philosophers.

Canada, Rising Sophmore

1. What are your thoughts on standardized testing? Good or bad? Why so?
Meh. I can see the need for it, its really the only way to easily compare students, but it's also a bad way of assessing their intelligence. The ability to memorize everything isn't necessarily useful in real life. More non-multiple choice questions are a necessary addition.

2. What are your thoughts on special needs education? Good or bad? Why so?
It's an excellent idea, so long as it's kept separate from regular student education. People can be mean, and a negative environment is no good for these kids. Plus, classes would be drastically slowed for some students.

3. Do you feel Sexual education is an important class? Do you feel it should be improved, stay the same or be removed?
It definitely is important, but it also definitely needs improvement. There's still no real teaching other than the basics. There should be things about non-heterosexual people and how to deal with them (or how to deal with heterosexual people if you aren't).

4. Do you think we should teach more general subjects? A "prepare you for life" class, basically.
Like Economics and Taxes and Stuff? Absolutely. One required class isn't enough to prepare you to pay your mortgage. But vocational classes should remain optional. No need to teach a skill someone isn't going to use.

5. Do you think the maths classes are important, and if so, important for what? Are they good,bad? Do they need improvement et al?
Math is of course, important, up to a point. Colleges definitely shouldn't care if you take 4 years of math if it's because you took Calculus or Precalc as a Junior, unless you have an intention of going into a mathematical field. But classes up to that point, Either Algebra II or Pre-Calculus, are important to just knowing how to figure things out in life.

6. What are your thoughts on the current state of Social studies classes? Do you think they are doing a good job?
No. I know there isn't really time, but they need more depth. You can't go over the entire history of Rome in 3 weeks. Likewise, you can't then spend 6 weeks on China. It needs both Balance, and Depth, neither of which do I see in public school. You need to take an AP class to really get anything out of it, which just isn't good for non-AP level students.

7. What are your thoughts on language classes? Good or bad ? Need improvement?
Jesus Christ please save this program. It's such a good idea and so poorly executed. First thing, get native born speakers to teach the class. Having white people who were born in LA, USA (Seriously, there's a teacher at my school) who majored in Spanish as a language teach Spanish, is not the same as having a person born in Ecuador or Mexico teach Spanish. Also, speaking needs work, as a student entering Spanish 3, I can write and translate well, but I still have trouble speaking.

8. Do you think evolution theory should be taught in schools? If so, what about creationism? What other theories?
Of course! Its the most scientifically sound theory on the subject of human origin. Perhaps, for those who disagree, a part of the unit could be on other possible theories, but it's important that people understand that the theory with the most evidence should be the one taught.

9. Do you think the social environment in public school is great? Do you find it lacking? Should it exist at all?
Oh, it's brutal, but it's also entirely necessary. People aren't going to be nice in the real world. People aren't going to be mean either. School is for learning about society as much as it is about intelligence. I don't see how you could have school without it BTW.

10. What are your thoughts on the extracurricular activities? Such as art, chorus, orchestra, JROTC, Sports, or Shop class. Do some need to leave? Do others need improvement?
I understand why you have to pay to participate in a lot of these, but it's unfair to students who can't afford it. Regardless, these are just as important as other classes. Again, it teaches social skills. I find that our extracurriculars are well rounded.

11. What are some classes you'd like to see?
Dear god we need more specific classes. It's too hard to spend so little time on each "Unit."
Personally, I'd love to see a European History class (though my school might have one...I need to check)

I'd say I'm definitely not PhD on geography, but people mistake my general intelligence for Classical antiquity history for arrogance. That said, I am currently interested in learning some Asian antiquity history, I'm also trying to memorize the Mediterranean philosophers.

It can sound arrogant to a less taught, but again, my two first points still stand, as for your history knowledge, I remember asking you about antique Armenia, and neighbours. All you said were pretty basic stuff, Armenia and Pontus medium power, while Iberia-Albania were small countries to the north that were pretty weak and noone cared for.

Ancient Armenia is not much to say about. It has its unique facts like most countries. It's best summarized as a failed Parthian Empire.

Ruled by Orontids, Artaxiads, interesting relations with Selucids are just things I found on basic look. They have plenty primary sources, too - although Armenian alphabet was made in 405 CE, Armenians before then just wrote in Greek and Aramaic script.

Ancient Armenia is not much to say about. It has its unique facts like most countries. It's best summarized as a failed Parthian Empire.

4/20. Would not blaze.

How about rename primary and secondary school. Add a sixth day worldwide and a better education plan.

Education can be compressed by 2 years if done right or alleviate college/university.

Too much free time and integrals are easy. Could be done in high school. It seems like older people had better education.


Greek education, philsophy, math philosophy, physics philosophy, music, gym.astics, war, poetry and many more things. Pretty much classic education that Rabelais wanted in his Gargantua.

It's good to know so many people have thoughts about this topic.

I think my next thread will be pictures of my cat.

How about rename primary and secondary school. Add a sixth day worldwide and a better education plan.

Education can be compressed by 2 years if done right or alleviate college/university.

Too much free time and integrals are easy. Could be done in high school. It seems like older people had better education.

Primary and secondary school are fine names. And if you want to have mad thoughts, how about making what you learn at school completely directed by you from start to end, and free schooling everywhere, and destigmatising non-degree holders, to the point where it was like the 1700s (when, if you went to a higher teaching institute, you really wanted to learn, you were fiercely loving this topic); instead of just folk going to university because they have to.

Greek things are good, but come on, over 2000 years ago. They couldn't even get an unitary theode for most of the time. Instead of what you suggest, here is what we should have:

Modern, experimentally proven effective teaching, learn to love to learn, the sciences (the big three: biology, chemistry and physics), computer programming, tae kwan do, contemporary music.

Edited 9/3/2015 06:10:54

I think my next thread will be pictures of my cat.

Finally something better then this spam.

It'd be good too, to have middle school/ high school classes on programs like HTML5, C++, etc.

HTML5/CSS3 don't really require much computational thinking, so I hope any web design class stays very design-focused.

Tyrion, if you're interested in learning programming in high school, MIT OpenCourseWare has intro CS available. Alternatively, you can always check any CMU CS course (try fast-paced intro CS: https://cs.cmu.edu/~112) and go to Schedule where they link to all course content except for solutions. I'd recommend heading to an earlier iteration of the course since the newest one is just two lectures in.