http://goo.gl/fa4SUr

Vote.

Also, discuss.

I don't believe America should be involved in the middle east because I don't think the U.S. gov would be willing to make a real attempt at change for the better- just waste money trying to spend as little as possible.

I thought we were in North America. When did we join the Middle East?

Must've missed something.

What do mean by leave? This is quite vague. No more embassies? No more foreign policy advisers or ambassadors? In general I believe the USA cannot end 2000 year old sectarian, religious, and political feuds in the Middle East. I also don't think we can spend our way to creating Democracy in the Middle East.

I think that apart from ensuring Kurds don't get overrun they should let Assad, the rebels and ISIS have a rumble, then treat with the winners.

Even tho I'm libertarianism, I am right wing on the military. I believe the military should focus more on updating and research but in the end, I want a big focus of our national GDP to go to military funding, period.



Should we leave? Are we even actually in the middle east?. Last time I checked, we pulled out of Iraq, we pulled out of Afghanistan, we pulled out of Lebanon so basically all that's left are bases scattered across the Arabian peninsula. America needs to maintain a relative presence in the middle east for Israel and to keep the world's Biggest supplier of oil stable ( or at least, attempt ). I firmly believe we should only get involved if Israel requests aid and there country is under invasion, or if there is a massive threat to our suppliers of oil. Yeah yeah i know, Bush killed for oil blah blah I have heard the propaganda plenty but in reality, all the dam green protesters and major liberals aren't gonna keep the world economy spinning . What will? Oil.



I am all for green energy and in fact i am a major tree hugger but I'm also realistic. All the good saving of the environment will not supply our homes with gas. I think much of our governments resource should go to finding an alternative fuel source. In conclusion, realistically unless we want civilization to collapse then no, America can't completely pull out of the middle east

America is self sufficient in oil. No need to invade the middle east anymore. Plus, every time the US go there it becomes worst.



They first trained rebels against the russian invasion of afghanistan
=> Created Al-Qaeda

Then, they invade the Irak and destabilize the country because their dictator puppet (Saddam), isn't much of a puppet anymore
=> Made Al-Qaeda stronger and destroyed the country

After this, Al-Qaeda attacks the US (9/11)
=> They invade Afghanistan to clean the mess they've created 20 years before. Bonus: it becomes a quagmire and the US can't retreat their forces.

Again, they will invade Irak with false alegations of weapons of mass destruction
=> Destabilizes the country and make people hate the US all over the globe Bonus: it becomes a quagmire and the US can't retreat their forces.


A few years later, Arab Spring. One more opportunity to screw the hole region.


First, the US help to take down Gaddafi (with Europe, let's not forget).
=> Creates a huge vacuum of power, the country becomes a mess (helping to destabilize the region) and a door for imigration to Europe.

Then, they support Syrian rebels against Asaad, who doesn't fall like Gaddafi, but rather resists.
=> 250 thousand killed (Even more then Bush in Irak, gj Obama), destabilizes the country, and then Irak whom military (armed by the US), suffers debacle after debacle. Birth of Isis and massive refugee crisis in Europe.



Now you wan't to say the US should keep their interests in the middle east? GO F*CK YOURSELF! Everything you touch there becomes explodes in your hands. You won't even accept the refugees you created in the middle east.

Pleas, make me a favor, stop being dumb.

I thought we were in North America. When did we join the Middle East?

Ever since the first damn brown raghead set foot in glorious 'Murica

In all seriousness though, I couldn't agree with TeamGuns more. Get the fuck out, it's not your problem.

Good luck staying out of middle east for long.

The US was born in gunfire, and now they want to bring the gunfire to the middle east, because they think their gunfire is better.

This interventionism only benefits the banksters. I doubt many people want to die in a foxhole in Syria.

" Get the fuck out, it's not your problem. " I can not wait for England to have her version of 9/11, I shall remember this quote lol



Afgan was justified completely and so is the war on terrorism in general but Iraq was just a shit fest that was a waste of time and money. If Iraq actually had a nuke then I would be 100% in favor invading all over again but until then we should stay out. Iran is different, if all else fails we can just hammer them to death with aircraft without ever needing to invade.


The war on ISIS, in my opinion, is one of Obama's successes. We are teaching the Arab countries that big brother America is not always gonna deal with there shit. The only thing I would do different is put more advisors on the ground and increase air strikes, besides that I am pretty much happy with the way it is. We are slowly but surely winning, which is better then being in a ground war with car bombs for the next 5 years.


The funny thing is, I hear all these Europeans talking about how evil America is and how she should not be the world policemen and every time I see those comments I laugh to myself because the irony is so high. For much of the 20 century, America has basically, along with NATO, kept the free world safe. Of course America has made mistakes but why be so quick to turn your backs and insult us? we have kept your asses out of the fire for a long time so the least you can do is be a bit understanding. Besides, the UK, France, and others are just ' evil ' as America has been in this century. In fact, if we are measuring hiw many evil things modern countries have done, America would not be near as close to the top as England or France. My main point? Criticism of America is extremely overated and we have done farrrrrrrrrrr more good then bad

Edited 2/6/2016 19:12:27

* sigh * America does too little about something, and we are selfish and evil but if America gets too involved, we are evil and imperialistic.


^ Some days I want to scream at the far left " For gods sake pick one and stay with it! "

Edited 2/6/2016 19:17:40

America does too little about something, and we are selfish and evil but if America gets too involved, we are evil and imperialistic.

+1. How do you please people who hate our country?

Don't you love how the same people who say America is evil and should not get involved in anything, owe there existence as a free nation to America. Why? Because America got involved XD

BTW Jai check out my profile pic, I saw it the other day and I had to use it

Edited 2/6/2016 19:41:21

I'm not saying America is evil, I'm saying that the people running it are evil warmongers who invest in the destruction of nations. Bill Clinton and George Bush Sr tore apart Yugoslavia, Bush Jr tore up Iraq and Afghanistan(which was unneeded as Afghanistan offered up Osama) , and Obama tore apart Syria and Libya. All at the cost of tens of thousands of lives(both American and foriegn) , the liberty of many people to govern their country independently and the liberty of the American people (though the patriot act). We can go back further, but I consider acts committed by America during the Cold War partially justified due to the circumstances.

America's role in the Middle East is completely pointless. The only reason we have to be over there is the War on Terror. We are actually responsible for much of the Islamic terrorism that occurs; in our quest to bring "democracy" to the middle east we've destabilized actual governments (Saddam Hussein's Iraq, Qaddafi's Libya, Assad's Syria) and left power vacuums for radicals to take over. We've also been supporting Israel which has no place in the Middle East.

The only thing America should be doing is propping up benevolent dictators that oppose radical Islam. We have no obligation to "democratize" the Middle East, we have an obligation to our own safety and fueling radical Islam by destabilizing regimes is UNACCEPTABLE AND DANGEROUS.

1: Afghanistan was a justified war for many reasons if not only to show that if you fly American planes into buildings, your as good as fucked. ( BTW I never remember hearing about Afghanistan giving up Bin laden but if it was the official government then it probably meant shit. And if what you say is true, The US Would have taken Bin laden if some afghan faction offered him up on a golden platter )


2: Somebody had to do something in Yugoslavia, Thousands of people were dying in the " cleansing " Which was the closet thing to Hitlers death camps since WW2. We also had UN and NATO support so it was nothing like Iraq


3: OP Desert storm was tricky. If Saddam had not been stopped, he would have plowed right into Arabia and at the time it would have been a blood bath. But on the other hand, the Arabian states would have united to stop Iraq eventually with or without America so it was all a matter of time. There was no bad or good way out of that war, just victory

4: Syria and Libya I got no excuse, your right it was not needed.

5: I already said I was against the Iraq war

6: I hate the patriot act, its unconstitutional and it violates personal freedom. However, many plots were stopped because of that advantage the NSA had. In the end, Its a question of if we are willing to trade our freedom for security

Conservative, you are politically brainwahsed. Its not even funny anymore.

I can not wait for England to have her version of 9/11, I shall remember this quote lol

I don't give a fuck if The Houses of Parliament are bombed or some shit. In fact, Guy Fawkes should have done that, hundreds of years ago.

SCOTTISH, NOT ENGLISH.

Afgan was justified completely and so is the war on terrorism

Yeah, it was justified, but it was executed HORRIBLY.

but Iraq was just a shit fest that was a waste of time and money.

Agreed.

If Iraq actually had a nuke then I would be 100% in favor invading all over again but until then we should stay out.

WHAT? FUCKING WHAT? You'd invade a country if it had a fucking nuke?!? They'd USE THE NUKE of course! This is why it was so obvious they were lying? Who would invade a country that has nukes? WHO?

Iran is different, if all else fails we can just hammer them to death with aircraft without ever needing to invade.

Just leave Iran alone... Let them do their own thing and they won't hate America so much.

The war on ISIS, in my opinion, is one of Obama's successes.

Except that ISIS have barely gotten weaker ever since America has joined the war...

We are teaching the Arab countries that big brother America is not always gonna deal with there shit.

Wait, so it's completely fine to destabilise a country to the point of collapse, but it's not ok to say "Sorry, I fucked up. Let me help you get back on your feet."?

The only thing I would do different is put more advisors on the ground and increase air strikes,

I don't even think America need to be in the war. They've done so little to help that they're just looking for moral high-ground and being on "the right side of history" at this point.

besides that I am pretty much happy with the way it is.

Look, America need to either say "Ok, we're not doing anything anyway. Better just leave them alone." Or (what I actually agree with) "We need to kill the terrorists efficiently. Not what we're doing now, efficiently."

We are slowly but surely winning, which is better then being in a ground war with car bombs for the next 5 years.

It might be ok for AMERICA. But while all of this is happening, spillover is affecting Turkey, surrounding countries are getting flooded with migrants, fascism is rising in Europe, the area is becoming less and less stable, and more and more depopulated, ISIS are dwindling at a really slow pace, so they'll just strike more and more world capitals, and more damage will be done in the long term. Kill them now, before anything worse happens.

The funny thing is, I hear all these Europeans talking about how evil America is and how she should not be the world policemen and every time I see those comments I laugh to myself because the irony is so high. For much of the 20 century, America has basically, along with NATO, kept the free world safe.

"The free world". By "free world", you basically mean "'Murica and her allies", right? I don't care whether a country is France, or Jordan, or Mongolia, Nigeria, or whatever, if America is keeping themself safe, but then putting other countries (Libya or Iraq) to shit, then they always use the excuse "we're helping the FREE world". And hurting the millions of people that aren't in "THE FREE WORLD". Nobody cares! Just don't kill millions of people FFS!

Of course America has made mistakes but why be so quick to turn your backs and insult us?

Lol because you fail so much. Britain have failed too. Blair was a fucking dumbarse haha. America have barely succeeded in their foreign interventions recently and they've become a joke.

we have kept your asses out of the fire for a long time so the least you can do is be a bit understanding. Besides, the UK, France, and others are just ' evil ' as America has been in this century.

Ok, UK have been dumb cunts as well, but it's funnier because USA fail more. They've fucked up so many times and on a grander scale. France, I wouldn't agree with. They stayed out of the Iraq war and have a better foreign policy than Britain.

In fact, if we are measuring hiw many evil things modern countries have done, America would not be near as close to the top as England or France.

You're contradicting yourself. You firstly say "this century" and then bring back Empire. Overall? Yeah Britain and France have done more bad things. This century? America, definitely.

My main point? Criticism of America is extremely overated and we have done farrrrrrrrrrr more good then bad

Alright, list me as many good things on a foreign-policy level when America have done "the right thing". I can definitely top it with all the bad things they've done.

Don't you love how the same people who say America is evil and should not get involved in anything, owe there existence as a free nation to America. Why? Because America got involved XD

Scotland was never invaded by the Nazis.