"The moment you give Manager Rights to someone- unless you're placing them under some sort of binding contractual obligation- you're consenting to anything they could do with Manager Rights. It's spelled out right in the "Clan Managers" submodule, right where you go to transfer Manager Rights."

First off, when your giving someone else power like that it's legally a joint leadership.
Because of that if semice wanted to say empty the clan out like an ass he would have the power to do so, but not necessarily the right. As he would not own the clan.

@Knyte

I would appreciate it if you stuck to an account and did not use your alt aswell.

First off, when your giving someone else power like that it's legally a joint leadership.

It's a joint leadership where you openly grant them the ability to seize full control at any given point in time.

Warlight spells it out: they can "even remove you from the clan if they wanted to take control." You're knowingly consenting to that the moment you give someone Manager Rights.

@madking: I'm currently active on both. Sorry if it's confusing. :P

Edited 5/19/2016 01:05:55

And actually it is your right to remove his comments if you find them offensive as you in your own words "own" the clan.

Just as Fizzar has the right to to remove this comment. He owns warlight and i'm merely a guest.

"Warlight spells it out: they can "even remove you from the clan if they wanted to take control." You're knowingly consenting to that the moment you give someone Manager Rights."

Exactly! Your giving them power, but they do not own the clan as there would be multiple leaders.

What it comes down to is regardless of what power you give him, the guy who bought the clan owns the clan legally in real life.

And actually it is your right to remove his comments if you find them offensive as you in your own words "own" the clan.

There's no mechanism for me to remove those comments. That's not a service Warlight provides, and it's not a service I can expect to get as it was never expressly required of Warlight under any terms.

So the moment I add someone to the clan, I give them the ability to make posts/comments on our Clan Forum that I can't remove. Simple as that.

As far as ownership goes, that's not simple at all. Given Fizzer's policy of restoring clans to the original purchaser, I believe that clans are simply services Warlight provides and ultimately are always (legally) owned by Fizzer. People can just transfer control.

Exactly! Your giving them power, but they do not own the clan as there would be multiple leaders.

The owner of the clan is Fizzer- hence his ability to transfer control to people if he wants to. Clans are services, not products; you're really purchasing a subforum on Warlight and some other digital services. And you're transferring your rights/controls over that service to anyone with MR.

Edited 5/19/2016 01:12:47

"The owner of the clan is Fizzer- hence his ability to transfer control to people if he wants to. Clans are services, not products; you're really purchasing a subforum on Warlight and some other digital services. And you're transferring your rights/controls over that service to anyone with MR. "

Then what was this about semice owning the clan when he was given MR?

And i guess your technically right no one owns the clan but Fizzar.

But the guy who bought it technically has the rights to its use. Not semice.

Then what was this about semice owning the clan when he was given MR?

Semice was in control and had the rights to the service the Fizzer was providing.

Transferring MR is directly how you transfer control to someone else. Under Fizzer's terms, he transfers this control back to the original purchaser when no one else is in control, but otherwise the people with Manager Rights are exactly the ones with rights to its use.

It's not Semice's fault that Colonel gave him those rights and the ability to control aspects of the clan, and he's not liable in any way whatsoever for using them in a way that Colonel didn't want him to.

Colonel's not even the original purchaser of the clan and himself gained control through a transfer of Manager Rights.

Edited 5/19/2016 01:38:25

Then i ask you why fizzar banned his alt?

"Manager Rights are exactly the ones with rights to its use."

Wrong they are still guests. The only one who has the right to decide what happens to the clan on a large scale is either fizzar or the guy who actually spent REAL money for the clan.

It's literally legally only fizzars or the guy's choice that matters.

Because, the clan is worth money and only the buyer has the right to the clan because it's his money. Permission to kick and abuse the clan does not make you the leader.

"Colonel's not even the original purchaser of the clan and himself gained control through a transfer of Manager Rights."

Of course he's not the original "owner", but again he does not own the clan and did not change the clan in any harmful or major way.

He has power, but not the right.

The amount of victim blaming in this thread is outright amazing

+1 for hijacking the thread about hijacking

Then i ask you why fizzar banned his alt?

I have no idea. I also don't actually know whether the hijacking account was indeed Semice's alt; there's been conflicting claims and only Fizzer has any reasonable method to confirm.

Wrong they are still guests. The only one who has the right to decide what happens to the clan on a large scale is either fizzar or the guy who actually spent REAL money for the clan.

Not at all. The person who spent real money for the clan also has the power to transfer their rights. They're able to give someone else control over their clan service if they want to (as clearly outlined in the "Clan Managers" submodule), and that's how it even got to Colonel in the first place.

Because, the clan is worth money and only the buyer has the right to the clan because it's his money

When you purchase a clan, you're also purchasing the right to transfer your rights to use that clan. That's exactly what the Manager Rights module does. Fortunately, Fizzer doesn't destroy the clan you purchased the right to use when you relinquish your MR; instead, he lets someone else claim the service.

I'm not sure where your claims about the "right" are even coming from. Are you aware of some Terms of Service document I haven't run across? To the extent of my knowledge, there's no specific terms outlining "rights" in the context of MR transfer beyond what's listed on the "Manage and remove players" module- no contractual restrictions on what someone can/cannot do with their MR, so ultimately they have a right to use Manager Rights any way they see fit- it's very clearly spelled out.

Edited 5/19/2016 01:54:21

Hmm, i suppose in a roundabout way you are correct. But then there is ultimately no point in buying a clan if everyone and no one owns the clan.

Now i really want a separation between who owns the clan and who is simply a mod.

You should not have to give someone the clan just to have an extra mod.

There is a point. You're paying for a service that Fizzer provides, and now you have control over a clan page, icons, a forum, etc. Fizzer's also nice enough to let you transfer control over said service to other people, just in a weird way where everyone who has control over the service also has the ability to take away everyone else's control (or grant control to a new set of people).

It's only a very small minority of clans that has these "hijack" problems, and that's because they're under the impression that they can have their MR transfers and eat them too.

You should not have to give someone the clan just to have an extra mod.

That'd be the perfect solution. Right now, clan managers are forced to tightly control rights because the only options are no control and full control. I can't just give someone recruitment privileges or clan page editing privileges. It'd be great if we had a tiered management system.

Edited 5/19/2016 02:03:09

That'd be the perfect solution. Right now, clan managers are forced to tightly control rights because the only options are no control and full control. I can't just give someone recruitment privileges or clan page editing privileges. It'd be great if we had a tiered management system.

Now that is what you are actually supposed to use UserVoice for!

210 votes (#6): https://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warlight-features/suggestions/7085564-overhall-of-clan-system

Clan manager tiers is certainly something we’d like to add some day, but it’s not on our immediate roadmap.

(emphasis mine)

77 votes (#16): https://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warlight-features/suggestions/5885580-clan-manager-improvement

No official response

26 votes: https://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warlight-features/suggestions/7955508-add-a-hierarchical-clan-management-system

No official response

Edited 5/19/2016 02:19:23

Regardless i still think semice should be punished in some way.

This thread is pointless isn't it. Just report Semice, don't create a dedicated thread to try ban him. Anyway I think he already tarnished his reputation with the Warlight community with this incident.

Edited 5/19/2016 02:22:18

Let's dispel once and for all with this notion that Colonel didn't know what he was doing. Colonel knew exactly what he was doing. He was undertaking a systematic effort to transfer a set of significant privileges to Semice and let Semice do whatever he wanted with it.

Robo Rubio reference lololol
+2