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- downvoted post by Major General Smedley Butler
- downvoted post by GeneralPE
who won the debate?: 2016-09-28 15:09:55


TeamGuns
Level 59
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This election should be an easy republican win, if they had a normal nominee they'd be destroying Hillary. She is such a bad candidate that Trump, also a terrible republican pick, managed to be one point behind of her now, but it's doubtful he'll win.

This was supposed to be a total republican win, and they would control the senate, the house and the white house; Hillary wouldn't have a chance against Romney, McCain, Kasich or Perry. They'd be beating her by at least 10 pts now.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-28 15:43:53


Ox
Level 58
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I don't know enough about American politics to argue your initial statement, but I'd like you to go back on using Perry as an example. Let me remind you of-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PAJNntoRgA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uvmKnFY4uk

... I don't think this spastic would beat Hillary in any world.
- downvoted post by Major General Smedley Butler
who won the debate?: 2016-09-28 16:03:44


TeamGuns
Level 59
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Eh Trump is almost beating her, Perry definetly would, as would Cruz and Carson; you guys underestimate how little democrats like Hillary. If Trump wasn't the alternative, many liberals wouldn't vote and some core democrats would even vote republican.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-28 20:14:45


Tchaikovsky Reborn
Level 41
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I think the moderator won. He was quite fair, and realized when he should just let the two go at it.



The real thing my friends and I were looking for was "could Donald Trump handle himself?". I was disappointed.
There were many times where Trump could have brought up some dirt, but he seemed hesitant. His attacks are probably one of his greatest assets. His charisma and personality is a big part of him.
When it came to what the policies were, both candidates ignored the question in favor of sparring. Hillary won, becauase she kept Trump on the defensive, something I did not expect. Trump also seemed a bit nervous.

I hope that Trump can compose himself, and do well next time. And maybe the candidates will actually talk about their positions. Or maybe Johnson will get up there and bring some fresh air into the election where both candidates are the lowest-approved of any election in the US.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-28 23:45:06

MasterOfWarZone
Level 50
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"No. And no. Trump leads most nonbiased polls (I saw one that polled 45% or so Obama voters and 30%ish Romney voters)."

No, he really doesn't.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/2016_elections_electoral_college_map.html
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/us/elections/polls.html?_r=0
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-election-forecast/
http://www.270towin.com/maps/consensus-pundit-electoral-map

fivethirty eight got 99 out of 100 states right between the last two elections with their predictions. They're giving Clinton 282 electoral votes and Trump 256.

Stop lying to yourself, Trump's absolutely not in the lead.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 01:32:58


ZeroBlindDragon 
Level 60
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Hillary won the 1st debate. She was very calm and prepared while Trump took the bait.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 01:38:22


GeneralPE
Level 56
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Trump was very calm. Could've killed her with a few openings, but refrained and appeared very stable to undecided voters. He lost the debate but won the voters
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 01:49:14


Жұқтыру
Level 56
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I think it's kids wanting to be edgy and anti-establishment.


that's likely part of it, too.
- downvoted post by Wally Balls
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 07:47:34


Tytus Lannister
Level 37
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Hillary won easily. Trump's constant interruptions and outright lies about his taxes and the effects his economic policies will have show just how unfit for this position he is. If he can't handle Hillary informing us about thing he has actually said and done, how is he supposed to be a substantial force in our foreign affairs?
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 08:41:47


indibob
Level 61
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Hillary won the debate but lost voters.
She really is the epiphany of all that people don't like about politicians.
Plastic, lying, smarmy.... Whereas Trump came across as unprepared but human.

Throughout the primaries the pundits never gave him a debate win, it was always Rubio or Cruz.
Online polls though always said he won as they did after this debate.

The people know who they like better than the media think they know.
Trump steamrolled the popular vote far exceeding expectations. He will do so again at the main event
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 09:23:24

francisco0002
Level 49
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Trump did quite well considering he was fighting 2 opponents
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 09:26:25


ZeroBlindDragon 
Level 60
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@indibob: If you paid attention to Reddit (/r/The_Donald) and 4Chan, you would notice huge posts dedicated into bombarding online polls to show Trump won the debate. Thus, I would put more faith into polls conducted by phone.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 10:26:26


Sułtan Kosmitów
Level 64
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The question is what does it mean to win the debate.

Hillary was better prepared, declaimed wiser and generaly presented herself better.

But I think noone there won the votes of the undecided minority.
In this sad times people don't really care what politicians say, rather how they look or if they shout some populistic slogans loud and often.

Still, what does it mean to win a debate?
Well, no comunist nor trockist is capable of winning any debate in my eyes anymore. :p

But in democracy this are the voters, who decide who win debates, even if you have nothing interesting to say and keep repeting the same things. And as I don't really believe in polls time will show I guess.

Btw, the anchorman was slightly against Trump.

And all the personal arguments they used against him...really?!?

Ah forgot that it is democracy...
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 16:24:12


Ox
Level 58
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I think they both didn't have the right level of preparation.

Hillary was too prepared, and within the first 15 minutes tried to reframe the debate twice. The first attempt- trying to reframe it about trade- was entirely unsuccessful, and she abandoned it not long after attempting it. The second one, however, (when she mentioned the 2008 financial crisis) allowed Trump to take some massive bait. It was an example of Trump's defensiveness, that imo got him the loss, and Hillary's over-preparedness which made her weaker.

Trump was underprepared; he made a lot of silly statements, like "It's called business", and interrupted like hell. It might work against Jeb, but Hillary is completely different.

What does this show? It shows that both of them have next-to-no actual debate experience, and they both struggle to rebut points made instantly. A good debater has to be able to rebut points instantly, by thinking on their feet, but both of them demonstrated that they can't think on their feet well.

http://qz.com/791320/2016-presidential-debate-how-to-win-a-debate-according-to-the-world-champion-harvard-debate-team/

I recommend reading this article. In summary, it has these 3 key points when it comes to presidential debates.

responsiveness, clarity, and authenticity.

responsiveness- the most important part, and Hillary beat Trump in this regard. While she couldn't immediately rebut points well, she did manage to reframe the debate several times to her advantage, where Trump generally took the bait.

clarity- As far as how clear they were, they won in different regards. To your average American, Trump won. He uses the vocabulary of an 8 year old, which is actually smart, because it allows him to connect to as many Americans as possible, and is perhaps why he is managing to gain loads of blue-collar working class votes. Hillary is more clear, in outlining her policies. She gives a much more clear direction of "Point A goes to Point B goes to Point C", up until Z. Donald, on the other hand, makes the vague assertion of "She didn't make this change for 30 years; that means I am your lord and saviour!" From an intellectual standpoint, Clinton beat Trump.

authenticity- While Trump suffered a little from the whole tax-returns debacle of his, he managed to refute the claims against him quickly by diverting it to Hillary's clear opaque attitude. In general, Clinton: isn't very authentic; likes to flip-flop; has been involved in numerous scandals, and so on & so forth.

However, I feel like because of Clinton's policies+policy clarity+policy choice, that she makes a better candidate than The Donald right now, despite her unreliable tendencies.
who won the debate?: 2016-09-29 17:07:52

Japanball
Level 56
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Whatever happens, USA is going to be a shitty country for the next 4 years.
- downvoted post by KARRRRRRRR UL
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