“The male and female slaves which you have are to come from the surrounding nations; you are permitted to buy slaves from them. You may also buy the children of foreign workers who are living among you temporarily and from their clans which are living among you and have been born in your land. They become your property. You may will them to your children as property and make them slaves for life. But you must not tyrannize your brother Israelites."

Leviticus 25:44


Commentary: One of the most beautiful entries in this book. Although we are all supposedly equal in His eyes, clearly some of us are more equal than others.


Edit: Religious faith is based on fear. I understand that nihilism is not something many people warm up to. Look up Ouroboros and the cyclical nature of the universe (an idea I personally subscribe to), if I'm not mistaken, the Ouroboros symbol is the most ancient religious symbol still in use today. If you need to adhere to religious faith to live your lives without breaking down and having an existential crisis, adhere to one that doesn't tell you how to live your lives. We all have a brain, we all know how we would like to be treated, so
"All things therefore, as many as you might desire that men should do to you, so also you do to them, for this is the law and the prophets."

Matthew 7:12

Edited 2/15/2020 15:52:41

Seriously. How do you read such a book, and tell yourself that this nonsense is the word of god?

Genesis 19:8
“See now, I have two daughters who have not known a man; please, let me bring them out to you, and you may do to them as you wish; only do nothing to these men, since this is the reason they have come under the shadow of my roof.”

Allow men to rape your virgin daughters. That's their purpose supposedly.

Leviticus 25:44-45
"And as for your male and female slaves whom you may have– from the nations that are around you, from them you may buy male and female slaves. Moreover you may buy the children of the strangers who dwell among you, and their families who are with you, which they beget in your land; and they shall become your property."

Slavery is fine. Buy men, women, and children, make them work your land. God thinks this is a great idea.

Deuteronomy 22:20-21
"But if the thing is true, and evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death with stones, because she has done a disgraceful thing in Israel, to play the harlot in her father’s house. So you shall put away the evil from among you."

Pre-marital sex begets being stoned to death. But only for women.

Leviticus 21:18-19
"For any man who has a defect shall not approach: a man blind or lame, who has a marred face or any limb too long, a man who has a broken foot or broken hand, or is a hunchback or a dwarf, or a man who has a defect in his eye, or eczema or scab, or is a eunuch."

Flaws of any kind are not accepted by god.

Leviticus 20:9
"For everyone who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death. He has cursed his father or his mother. His blood shall be upon him."

To go against your parents is to deserve death. It doesn't matter if they're good parents, or right, just side with them because they are your parents. Blindly follow them the way you blindly follow god.

2 Kings 2:23-24
Elisha 2 Kings
"Then he went up from there to Bethel; and as he was going up the road, some youths came from the city and mocked him, and said to him, “Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!” So he turned around and looked at them, and pronounced a curse on them in the name of the LORD. And two female bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youths."

Mocking an adult should result in death, even when they aren't your parent.

Psalm 137:9
"Happy the one who takes and dashes Your little ones against the rock!"

Murdering children sure sounds like a fun and joyous event.

Edited 2/15/2020 17:32:55

Deuteronomy 25:11-12
''If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.''

Ye, cut her hands off, how did she dare.

Deuteronomy 23:1
''He that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord.''

Don't dare to enter the holy churches if your genitals are damaged.

Ephesians 5:22
''Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord.''

Lick my boots, babe.

1 Peter 2:18
''Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel.''

Slavery rocks!

Exodus 22:18
''Do not allow a sorceress to live.''

BURN BABY BURN!!!

Genesis 19:18 is Lot's (incorrect) response to a bunch of sodomites surrounding and trying to break into his house to rape the two angels who came to investigate how wicked Sodom actually was. If you read the whole bible and think that every single thing in it is set forth as an example to follow, and not as history showing both the good and bad, it's easy to understand how you can misinterpret the bible so atrociously. Paul explains what God thinks of the homosexuals in Romans 1. He describes them as (Romans 1:29) "Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: 32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them."

Leviticus 25:44-45 and other related passages about slavery are correct. If you have a job, you would most likely would be considered a slave by the bible's standards. The only difference being that you aren't given room and board for free. I've talked about this in other posts.

Deuteronomy 22:20-21 is correct. If you can look at the 70's free love movement and consider it anything short of a disaster for the world at large, you have been propagandized by the US govt to the point of no return. Seek help.

Leviticus 21:18-19 is specifically about going into the holiest of holies, which only applies to the old testament priestly caste. The priest is supposed to be a picture of God in this setting, as the animals that are sacrificed supposed to be pictures of Jesus. In the new testament we are commanded to come BOLDLY into the holiest, no matter our infirmities.

Leviticus 20:9 is correct. Cursing your parents isn't simple teenage angst, it's closer to an adult who still into their 30's blames all their problems on their parents and wishes nothing but the worst for them. Remember that the old testament law was written for believers; if your parents were following the old testament law they were bound to be good parents.

2 Kings 2:23-24 is a misunderstanding of "youths" and missing the words "of the youths." The bible considers anyone under 18 to be a child, meaning that he was surrounded by a mob of teenagers in no small number, evidenced by two female bears being able to maul 42 OF them. Note the 42 OF them, signifying there were many more than 42. Being right near a village, if there were only 42 youths they probably could have escaped unharmed from the shebears. Also note that it says mauled, not killed.

Psalm 137:9 is about the captivity of jerusalem by edom, and the actions of edomites. you literally need to read only three sentences in front of this one to get the context. i assume this is the only verse you didnt find from a buzzfeed list; even they are too smart to pick out such an easily explained verse.

the image you posted is pretty funny in light of how many of these things are explained by two additional verses of context, or the explanations given in the bible by the new testament saints about the imagery and prophecy shown in the old testament. 1 Corinthians 2:14 rings more and more true every day, but even in the light of that verse, a lot of the problems you have with the bible stem from just poor reading and inferencing ability.

Deuteronomy 25:11-12 is correct. Women shouldn't be involved in brawls between males. How many women do you think actually got involved in a fight between two guys and seized one of them by his stones? It's obviously a deterrent.

Deuteronomy 23:1 is more applicable now than it was back then. Transgendered people who mutilate their bodies shouldn't be allowed in church. Note that it is only talking about being in the congregation, not about being saved. There is still a very, very, very slim chance they can be saved, but it's not worth the risk of having them around children in church.

Ephesians 5:22 is correct. Hierarchies have and will continue to be the best structure for families and government. How much lower would the divorce rate be among parents if the woman obeyed the man, and the man obeyed God? Aren't you concerned at all about the welfare of children? At our current rate of 50%, there really isn't much to be said for egalitarianism.

1 Peter 2:18 is correct. I explained this in another poast and will talk about this more later

Exodus 22:18 is correct. This obviously doesn't apply to women with bipolar disorder who start basing their life on tarot cards.

I have to go back to work but when i come back i will make an effortpoast about "slavery" in the bible

Edited 2/15/2020 19:46:19

Thank you neodanubian for actually going through these and explaining them one by one.
"...born in your land. They become your property. You may will them to your children as property and make them slaves for life. But you must not tyrannize your brother Israelites."

"But you must not tyrannize your brother Israelites" How does this fall into your explanation of labour and being a working citizen? Israelites should never have to work? Didn't God tell Adam that should earn his daily bread from the sweat of his forehead when expelling him and Eve from Eden?

Anecdote:
I had been discussing religion with someone and they gave similar arguments to what I've been reading here. I told them my grandmother was a very catholic woman, from a small town, could see the church from her balcony, that sort of thing. Kindest woman I have ever met, and everyone that has ever met her says this. She was a housewife, cooked and cleaned as I'm sure God would like. I'm not going to go into how my grandfather took advantage of this, didn't renovate the house until her final years, was out of the house almost every waking hour of the day etc, because I'm sure you will say she will be compensated with eternal bliss in Heaven.
I asked the guy I was speaking to if my grandmother was in Heaven, he said yes (feel free to suggest otherwise). I then told him that my mother had moved to a city far away from my grandmother (we had been discussing the correlation between urban and rural populations and why rural areas tended to be more religious), that my mother, from a very young age, didn't believe in God, in religion, in any of it, and that neither did I. I told him that although we were good people, we would most likely go to Hell. He agreed. I then told him, that according to what I said (and he had agreed with), my grandmother would spend an eternity in Heaven, away from my mother (who she loved more than life itself) and me, knowing that we would spend an eternity in Hell.
So I asked him again, is my grandmother in Heaven, and he literally said "God's work is beyong our understanding". If you cannot provide substantive arguments for your faith (something that quite literally dictates how you live your entire life), and rely on logical fallacies, or outright admitting ignorance about a faith that is supposed to provide answers, then we can't have a dicussion, so I did my best to leave as quickly as possible.

My question. Could you as a father spend an eternity in Heaven, knowing your son or daughter will not be with you? Is it really Heaven then? Could you imagine a mother leaving her child for an eternity? How could Jesus, or any Christian for that matter, live happily with the Lord, knowing that so many of us did not make it? Or is it that once your own salvation is secured, you could no longer care about us?

If there is a Bible verse that explains this, I'm happy to hear it. I would prefer to hear your own argument.

The world is not as black and white as people would like to believe, people's live are complicated, telling them to have faith or to "keep calm and carry on" might work for some, but others are just tired of it all, of surviving life, of not enjoying this great gift God has given us (allegedly). People should not have to endure hardships of life, especially when these hardships are unfair and human created, human evils imposed by other greedy people. Religion is therefore a belief in a delayed revenge so to speak, people know that these men are evil, be it politicians, CEOs or Prince Andrew himself, yet people do nothing, because we are stupid, or because we can do nothing. People resort to religion because they think "I can't take revenge on him now, but in the next life I will be blessed and he will not", rhetoric which helps keep people in line, while others (sociopaths, psycopaths, or just generally bad people) do whatever they please. Better to be content in this life, than to aspire to it in the next.

Edited 2/15/2020 23:11:25

longpoast about "slavery" in the bible

to set the stage, there are a lot of things in the old testament law which God does NOT condone, but there are still provisions and rules made for it in the law so things dont get out of control in areas of the world where these sort of things do occur. i dont know ur situation personally, but as for me, i dont own or desire slaves, so these verses dont apply to me. not everyone in the world is going to be living in the high minded, sophisticated, humanitarian countries of western europe and america, and god understood that and made the regulations as broad as he could. also throughout this poast im going to call anyone who speaks english an american bcs i feel like it.
first of all, you have to use the king james version if you're going to be discussing doctrine (i might explain this at some other point), and when you read all the verses about slavery, one thing will stick out: the word slave is not even mentioned. they are called servants. so we're obviously talking about two different things here. another reason why we know that this is not slavery as ur typical american would understand it is this verse in the very first chapter of the laws that deal with servitude: Exodus 21:16 "And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death." Note that the death penalty here also includes the mere transportation of slaves.
to drive this point that this isnt something based on racial hatred is that israelis could "buy" israeli servants, meaning that this isnt a racial superiority thing as americans innately think whenever they see "slavery" or "servitude." Exodus 21:2 reads "If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing." (this is the concept of jubilee years, not going to go into that here.) So in light of this, what all the verses following are about is indentured servitude.
Another difference between the servitude of the ancient days and slavery as americans understand it is in the rules about harming your servant. Exodus 21:20 reads "And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished." Exodus 21:26-27 reads "And if a man smite the eye of his servant, or the eye of his maid, that it perish; he shall let him go free for his eye's sake. And if he smite out his manservant's tooth, or his maidservant's tooth; he shall let him go free for his tooth's sake." so God is obviously very strict about how you can treat your servants, and this theme is reiterated in the new testament as well: Ephesians 6:9 says "And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him."

the first part of exodus 21 talks about a male and female servant getting married and having kids, and when the servitude period of the man is expired, he is given the opportunity to either stay with his wife and children in indefinite servitude, leave them with the master and go his own way, or purchase them from the master when he has the funds to do so. the first thing most americans would latch onto is the breaking apart of families, but it isnt fair to the servant's master to lose out on the money/labor that is owed him just because they got married while in servitude, and it wouldnt make any sense for the kids to go with dad for basic biological nurturing reasons.

my comparing ancient servitude and modern employment is still accurate. note that i said nothing about being self employed, which still grants a bit of self respect even today. you r quoting leviticus 25 and again u fail to read the surrounding verses. Leviticus 25:39-40 read "And if thy brother that dwelleth by thee be waxen poor, and be sold unto thee; thou shalt not compel him to serve as a bondservant: But as an hired servant, and as a sojourner, he shall be with thee, and shall serve thee unto the year of jubile." it says servant either way. im not sure what ur trying to get at there. the reason god makes provisions for indefinite servitude in the case of non hebrews dwelling in the land of israel is bcs they werent supposed to be there in the first place if the israelites followed gods commandments(not going to go into this now but maybe some other time).

as new testament believers we understand that jesus is to be found in every chapter of the bible, old and new testament. i touched on this briefly in the rules abt harming ur servant but i will repeat the verse here: Ephesians 6:9 says "And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him." so we can see that wen we read all the stuff about splitting up of families, the forbidding of excessive harm, and stealing ppl to make them servants, it paints a picture of how we are in servitude to God, his lovingkindness towards us despite our failures, and eternal security.
edit: im not interested in spending an hour a day writing out the basic responses to the gotcha verses, so before you poast them, pls do a quick cursory search for explanations and related passages on google. it will take u probably 2 minutes for each one.

Edited 2/16/2020 01:30:18

i dont know ur grandma, and im not a catholic, so i cant comment about that. ill just tell u wat the bible says abt gettin saved
Matthew 7:13-14 says "Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it." this may seem quite cruel to the unbeliever (because they are the ones that are heading to destruction), but it is extremely fair when u find out how easy getting saved is.

the bible says that we all are sinners. Romans 3:10 says "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:" and just to drive the point further that EVERYONE is a sinner, paul repeats himself 13 verses later: Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"
in revelation god reveals the sins that he considers worthy of hell. Revelation 21:8 lists these as "the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters," and at this point some people might think theyre in pretty good shape, but then the second half of the verse unfortunately exists: "and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." at this point im in a lot of trouble, bcs i dont want to go to hell even though i deserve it for my actions. some ppl like to explain away hell as a metaphor for just being dead, and the fire and brimstone as just being 6 feet closer to the core of the earth. this gets tossed out in Revelation 20:14, which reads "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."
now at this point things r looking pretty dire for me, and God understood that. so praise God that he send his son. Romans 5:8 reads "But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." and then peter reiterates this in 1 Peter 2:24, when he explains that that "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed."
things are looking better now, but how can u know for certain ur healed by the stripes that Jesus bore for us? the most famous verse explains this for us. John 3:16 says "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." this is the most important thing in the bible, and its where a lot of false religions masquerading as christianity fall short. when they see "believith in him," a million asterisks go off in their mind. what if I commit suicide? what if i dont give to the poor? what if i dont get baptized? what if i dont take the eucharist? most ppl cant handle having to do so little to recieve so much.
there is a story in the old testament, 2 Kings 5:10, that deal with this issue. Naaman, the commander of the army of aram, was afflicted with leprosy, and came to Elisha to cure him of his ailments. Elisha commanded him to "Go and wash in Jordan seven times, and thy flesh shall come again to thee, and thou shalt be clean" naaman was pretty upset about this since the jordan was right outside his house, and it even a very nice, clean, or grand river, so he refused to do it. fortunately his servants convinced him in 2 Kings 5:13, which reads "And his servants came near, and spake unto him, and said, My father, if the prophet had bid thee do some great thing, wouldest thou not have done it? how much rather then, when he saith to thee, Wash, and be clean?" finally he washes himself in the jordan seven times, and his health is restored.
now there wasnt anything special in the jordan river that day obviously, all naaman had to do was to wash and be cleansed, and thats all we have to do too. Ephesians 2:8-9 says "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." What was the gift of God? Paul tells it plainly in Romans 5:17: "For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ." Adam brought sin into the world, and Jesus provided a way out for ppl who believe on him.
I posted these verses before, but this is the complete plan for salvation, the same one all saved ppl in the bible used, from adam to abraham to the apostle paul. Acts 16:30-33 "And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house. And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway." This plan for salvation is the same one that is given in Romans 10:9-10: "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."
as we can see there is nothing that we do that ensures our salvation, all of it depends on christ alone. anyone depending on their actions to save them from hell is destined to be disappointed, because we all fall short. James 2:10 reiterates this once again "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all." the older i get the more and more thankful i am for that. as i look back on the choices that ive made in light of what is right and just i am nowhere near perfect, and nothing i do from now unto death will change that. Whatever we do in the world that brings pleasure to God, if we are not rewarded for it on earth, we will be rewarded for it in heaven, and how much greater are the things in heaven than on earth! Galatians 6:9 says "And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not."

now i will talk about freewill a bit more. i mentioned this before, but freewill as a computer programmer understands it is not how freewill works as God created it. if people were punished immediately for any evil they commit, is that really freewill? are evil people in a vaccuum, that their actions cannot harm other people? God knows that this isnt and shouldnt be the case. if we are not allowed to do evil on this earth, we do not have freewill.
Deuteronomy 5:9 reads "Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me," from this verse we can tell that actions made by a single person can affect their grandchildren and their great grandchildren. genesis has examples of this in the lives of abraham, isaac, and jacob and his sons. abraham went in unto his wife's handmaid and bore ishmael, whose descendants were a thorn in israel's side continually, and then later jacobs son Reuben went in unto his dad's concubine in the same fashion as Abraham, his great grandfather.
the bible is full of wicked people who changed their ways and became great prophets. Paul persecuted and murdered christians until he was converted, and he ended up writing half of the books in the new testament. there is still hope for all sinners, no matter how wicked they are. if they truly accept jesus into their lives, the old man is cast away.
under the old testament law rape, murder, incest, and other sins are punished by death, other sins are punished by fines, and some sins are not punished at all. but someday we are all going to be held accountable to god, and im thankful that i have eternal security through Jesus.

You are avoiding the question. Can you as a Christian live in Heaven knowing that so many of God's children, your brothers and sisters, are burning in Hell?

How can such a benelovent God see an eternity of damnation a suitable punishment for an average lifespan of 75 years of sin? I honestly cannot even remember the last time I lied about anything, my own bio says "If it is not right, do not do it, if it is not true, do not say it".

Every Bible verse you present as evidence, I will dismiss. “That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens

the word of the god is literally Jesus. John 1:1 says "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:14 completes this thought: "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." if you dont feel like taking the effort to read a couple quotes from the bible just say it outright.
none of God's children are in hell. Galatians 3:26 says "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus." if someone believes in jesus, they are a child of god, and therefore they arent going to hell. my brothers and sisters, both physically and spiritually, are going to be perfectly fine when the last trumpet sounds.
reread the plan for salvation i posted above. salvation is a free gift; you don't have to go to church to get it, you don't have to quit sinning to get it, you dont have to speak in tongues, win souls to christ, take the eucharist, or even get baptized to get it. all you gotta do is believe. if someone isnt willing to make that simple step, that one tiny leap of faith, to ensure their eternal salvation, they have no one to blame but themselves.
editing to mention that dumb quote. there are a million things that people assert without evidence every day. for the unbelievers, morals are entirely subjective. the reason murder, rape, etc are accepted as being evil, even among unbelievers, is explained in Romans 2:14-15: "For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)"
there are a million other resources on basic fundamental christian doctrines other than me out there, most of them saying the same stuff im saying here. please use the faqs before the forums.

Edited 2/16/2020 03:36:38

Romans 1:29
Show me one homosexual who fits this definition. Seems like those two angels misinformed your omniscient god.

Leviticus 25:44-45
It doesn't make sense to compare slaves with employed ones, employed people are allowed to leave and join as they wish. Moreover, they get paid. Slaves don't.

Deuteronomy 22:20-21
Adultery might be wrong but honour killing only women is not certainly a good idea. It's cruelty by your omnibenevolent god.

Leviticus 21:18-19
That's definitely a lot of injustice from your righteous god.

Leviticus 20:9
Cursing parents is one of the worst things a child can do but honour killing should not be an answer. Not from your omnibenevolent god.

2 Kings 2:23-24
I don't get this explanation.

Psalm 137:9
I get that one.

a lot of the problems you have with the bible stem from just poor reading and inferencing ability.
Why did your god make bible hard to understand then? To keep poor and underprivileged under control and deprived?

Deuteronomy 25:11-12
That's the point, no woman grabs a man's privates while getting between a brawl. Your god sounds stupid even stating these non-happening thing. Totally a failure.

Deuteronomy 23:1
Wow, that's justice. Make a woman lower to male, submit to the husband, cover head, make her work the entire day at home and if she disapproves and changes gender, how did she dare?

Ephesians 5:22
A utopia built upon suppressed people would not be utopia at all.

1 Peter 2:18
Explain that.

Exodus 22:18
Sorcery doesn't even exist. And if it exists why only women?

@Marcus Adding onto neodanubian's response, the bible calls unbelievers children of wrath, not children of God.
Eph. 2:3 - "Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest."

The same God who is described as good and loving is also described as just and a consuming fire... you can't ignore certain attributes of God. Since God is just, He must punish sin. If a judge pardoned someone because they said, "Look at all the good things I've done", that wouldn't be a just judge.
Prov. 17:15 - "He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous, Both of them alike are an abomination to the LORD."
Does this mean that God becomes an abomination to Himself when He allows any of us to be saved? No, because God's wrath was satisfied with the death of Jesus ("It is finished"). He became a curse and bore the punishment of our sins:
Deut. 21:23 - "his corpse shall not hang all night on the tree, but you shall surely bury him on the same day (for he who is hanged is accursed of God), so that you do not defile your land which the LORD your God gives you as an inheritance."
Let me rephrase your question: why would God send us a Redeemer to be able to spend eternity with Him in spite of all of the sin we've committed in our lives?

In today's special episode of Making White Dudes Type Paragraphs, a relatively wholesome thread about sharing inspirational Bible verses turns into... a full-blown internet dumpster fire!

Are we going to get a gay rights debate or abortion debate first? How long will we go before someone mentioning pedophilia and/or genocide? If someone quotes the Bible in a forest and no edgy internet atheist shows up to debate them, did it even really happen?

Stay tuned to find out, today on Making White Dudes Type Paragraphs, right after another multi-paragraph /r/atheism copypasta!

---

And now, back to your regularly scheduled Bible verse:

"For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven."

Mark 12:25 (KJV)

Commentary: Self-explanatory. There is no marriage (and by implication, no sex) in heaven. Those 72 virgins I was promised are going to remain virgins even after I show up to the party. :(

Edited 2/16/2020 06:08:00

So, damnation in christianity is just like:
'Accept jesus as god's son (blindly, without any sufficient evidence), follow and accept what he says (whether be it sexist, homophobic and cruel) your entire life (RIP free will), and you get into that boring heaven (how could you stay happy when your loved ones are in hell even if they didn't do a bad thing their entire life, the only allegedly bad thing they did was denying jesus as god's son, RIP benevolent god) (RIP those who never heard of jeses) and if you don't, you get into that hell where you'll get fried and fried and fried eternally. (RIP omnibenevolent god)

So, damnation in christianity is just like:
'Accept jesus as god's son (blindly, without any sufficient evidence), follow and accept what he says (whether be it sexist, homophobic and cruel) your entire life (RIP free will), and you get into that boring heaven (how could you stay happy when your loved ones are in hell even if they didn't do a bad thing their entire life, the only allegedly bad thing they did was denying jesus as god's son, RIP benevolent god) (RIP those who never heard of jeses) and if you don't, you get into that hell where you'll get fried and fried and fried eternally. (RIP omnibenevolent god)

Literally all those Bible verses you and Nauz posted, they all make sense if you actually read 1-3 verse before and after them. You can't "nit-pick" the Bible. They all make sense. All the violence is either the Israelites attacking the surrounding armies or other armies attacking the Israelites. So maybe go ahead and read the Bible verses before and after the ones you pointed out.

There have been many atheists setting out to prove the resurrection and the Bible wrong and inaccurate. They were changed by their own evidence. They set out to prove it wrong ,but were convinced it was right by all the evidence for it. One of those people being Lee Strobel, a former atheist journalist. He wrote The Case for Christ which I recommend you read! :D

@ganymedes @Marcus - there is total evidence for Jesus and Him rising again. If there was no evidence for the resurrection, there would be no point of Jesus and the Bible. But there is evidence. And I will be willing to PM you if you want about it? :)

In Heaven, there is no sadness or depression. Although, once in Heaven if we find out our son or mother or grandmother didn't believe in Jesus as the Son of God and come to Heaven , we will still find peace in our hearts that they heard about Jesus as the Son of God.

It says in the Bible no one pass away without hearing about Jesus as the Son of God and how He can save You WITH the exception of little infants. So, the person in Heaven would find peace in his/hers heart knowing their relative or friend heard about Jesus.


Everyone makes mistakes and God forgives him.

and you get into that boring heaven. God is preparing His believers mansions right now. As I said above , it as their choice to believe or not. God doesn't at all force people to believe. Jesus would not go where he was not wanted.

I think neodanubian talked great about that you don't need to get baptized, go to church, etc... You just have to take that little leap of faith and believe Jesus died for your sins and is the Son of God.

@Marcus and ganymedes, Jesus cares for you both and loves you both. He wants to believe in Him. He wants you to love Him as He does you.


Please, if you want to PM me, please do so.

Edited 2/16/2020 13:53:03

Doing good deeds and giving to the poor won't get you into Heaven.


Only believing that Jesus is the ultimate sacrifice and is the Son of God will.

@Marcus, if your grandmother truly believed Jesus was the Son of God, yes, she went to Heaven. If you accept Jesus as your Savior, you will get to be with her for eternity.

My great-grandfather died years ago. We had no idea if he believed or not. He died at 95 I think and was a great WW2 Bomber and won at least a dozen medals for that. He was an extremely nice person and very likeable. Remember, he went to church but that doesn't mean you are saved. There are some people who go to church to hang with friends or just listen to music. Anyways, right before he died, my grandparents were beside his bed. The window was open and they were about to close it, but then he said, although quiet, he said something like "Keep it open. A bright light is in the clouds coming for me."
He then died. It was a cloudy and dreary so there was no light outside really.
I believe he went to Heaven and was saved.

I hope that helps.

Please PM me if you have any questions or want to talk about anything

This will be my last message.

Again, you are all avoiding my question. Can YOU as a Christian live in Heaven knowing that so many of us are burning in Hell? I am not asking what the Bible says, I am asking what you think and feel.

What sin did children with anencephaly make, children born blind, horribly disfigured, whose every waking moment of every waking day is nothing but pain? Children who will never know love from a significant other, children who can never truly live life, who will never understand why it is that other people can walk and breathe comfortably but they are born with crippled legs and underdeveloped lungs. Children whose pain would translate into hate, if only they lived long enough. You are telling me that Jesus loves them, that they are all part of a plan we can never understand?

If thoughts and prayers work, do not pray for yourselves, only the selfish would do that. Pray for an end to global warming, pray to an end of rich pedophiles fucking little girls while the overwhelming majority of the population watches the very media that helps them maintain their egotistical operations. Christianity has been the dominant religion for over 1,500 years, and is arguably still dominant today, yet look at the world, look at what Christianity has done when it had absolute power, it surpressed criticism, it condoned wars in foreing lands (US clearly very Christian in this sense). In Spain the Catholic church sided with Franco, and today is exempt from tax because its Opus Dei cult has members in politics pulling the strings. Even Catholic priests fuck children.

Religion has always been a tool for control, dogmatic faith is pushed by clerics of the church so that a few individuals can keep their power, benefitting from a complacent population.

Christianity in a nutshell: God created all of us, browns, whites and yellows, and so we should love them, unless they live on land you want.

"Can YOU as a Christian live in Heaven knowing that so many of us are burning in Hell?" I can't live on earth knowing that so many people are going to burn in hell... I want everyone to be saved. I've often asked God why He saved me and not someone better, but I know I won't get the answer to that question on earth. While you're still on this earth, you have a choice as to whether you deny your will and follow God or not.

"What sin did children with..." They didn't commit any sins to be born that way. If they die young or if they're mentally underdeveloped, they'll go to heaven.

You must've missed my comment when I said that it's harder for the rich/powerful to get to heaven, precisely because they can abuse their power for their own selfish benefit. Christianity thrives when it's persecuted, not when it's a state religion. I'm a libertarian, so I oppose the foreign interventionism and suppression of freedom of speech you mentioned.

Libertarian, yet accepts authoritarian christianity.

@Viking, I remember you stating 'I have proof of god's existence' well, buckle it up if you have. I hope it's sensible, unlike bible and your psychopath god.

Talking of christianity being used as a political tool and priests raping children and nuns behind jesus's statue. Your god allowing that to happen, them taking advantage of a god thing and yet silent, doesn't make sense.
(Edit: Sorry even your god likes raping children, example 12-year-old Mary)

You know, I'm done here, all I wanted to prove was that christiany is flawed. A big thanks to @neodanubian for showing this religion's true face as sexist, double-standard, albeist, non-omnibenevolent and homophobic.
Moreover, reading through bible I don't feel like devil is evil. Between god and devil, god did all of the evils like murder, genocide, discriminate and rape a young girl.
Christianity was a product of frustrated men, not god. Otherwise he'd have made a religion that no one questions or at least doesn't take advantage and rape children and women right behind juses' statue.