GG's recent ladder success as you put it is underwhelming to say the least.

Angry Beavers hit rank 1 by stalling, Michael and BraaK hit rank 1 with incredibly low ratings because everyone good left the ladder.

GG is in no way, shape, or form better than Apex or WG. They might be better than WM, but WM is also worse than WG and Apex.

You claim WM gets a nod for Gnuffone winning a season and being rank 1 on the RT ladder. Surely WG gets just as much as one for Summer bouncing around in the top 5-10 on the 1v1 ladder, being top 3 on the RT ladder, and being poised to break the all-time record for highest rating ever on the 2v2 ladder, without resorting to stalling or cheating like the previous record holder.

As for:

"The best of Apex players are semi-retired. The most active members these days are Dead Piggy, Frank, Wid, Miyagi, Lolowut, Noob, with only 1 who has ever taken #1 on the 1v1 ladder. No offense but this team definitely don’t qualify as best on WL. "

Quit looking at ranks you incompetent sheep. It's obvious to anyone that watches and analyzes the games that Widz and Frank despite never hitting rank 1 are far better at strat 1v1 than all three of the GG members that recently hit rank 1.

Edited 7/13/2014 05:55:22

Widz and Frank despite never hitting rank 1 are far better at strat 1v1 than all three of the GG members that recently hit rank 1.

I disagree. With the exception of Braak whom I"ve never played, I believe Jupe and Beavers are better than Widsasz and Frank.

Gnuff taking #1 on Seasonal and RT ladder is more impressive than Summer being ranked around top 10 in 1v1 and RT ladder. If you disagree then you live up to your name.

You tell me to stop looking at stats and ranks? How else am I supposed to accurately rank clans? By people's perceptions about them?

GG don't pay me to sell them. I'm just saying what I think. Sounds like you're Nauz/ Silver to me.

Edited 7/13/2014 06:02:27

Silver isn't Nauz

" Summer Not Ranked with a rating of 2189. Summer's profile
Best rating ever achieved: 2216. Best rank ever achieved: 2nd
"

Is not "around" the top 10. It's rank 2.

Gnuffone wouldn't be rank 1 if he wasn't afraid to play anyone good.

Example: Records vs. top clans:

Lynx:
Gnuffone: 5-6
Summer: 6-1

WM:
Gnuffone: 4-1
Summer: 3-2 (includes 1-1 vs Gnuff)

Apex:
Gnuffone: 0-2
Summer: 2-0

WG:
Gnuffone: 1-1 (both vs. Summer)
Summer: 2-1

GG:
Gnuffone: 1-0
Summer: 0-0

20:
Gnuffone: 2-5
Summer: 2-1

So, combined vs. the top 6 clans Gnuff is 13-15, Summer is 17-5. Yeah, his RT ladder run is clearly way more impressive. Not.

New Phony
加油!

Which games are informing your opinion Pulsey? Widz especially has some great games on the ladder. To say that ctrl alt del is better detracts massively from the credibility of your list. Judging a player by their rank is a lazy substitute for looking at their games and playing with them.

From Pulsey's list. But better.

Elite clans- Top famous players, top in ladders etc, have their own fan club.

20
GG
WM
WG
Apex

Semi Elite clans- Good players, good success. One or two top players

Lynx
Masters

Strong clans
Xs
Ahol

Skilled clans- Mostly good players, not much ladder success

Xcd
French
Warlighters
Blitz

Large and competitive clans - Big clans, though with some skill.

VIW
REGL
BIA
Turtle
Gladiators
101st - Mostly good is a bit exaggerated. But we are trying. I still do recruitment. There are a few good-great players.

I believe Jupe and Beavers are better than Widsasz and Frank.


Is this a joke?

No. I've played all 4, on 1v1s and team games, though not admittedly not many with Wid, Jupe and Frank. Never played with Wid on team games.

Personal experience tells me Ctrl is better than Wid on 1v1s, Jupe better than Frank on team games. Or so I feel.

1v1s

Ctrl > Wid > Jupiter > Frank

Team Games

Jupiter > Frank > Ctrl

Anyway I'm not going to bother promoting players or a clan i'm not even part of. You can bicker among yourself. I'l publish a new guide in a few months :)

I also would put Masters in the semi-elite category.

Edited 7/13/2014 15:34:25

You tell me to stop looking at stats and ranks? How else am I supposed to accurately rank clans? By people's perceptions about them?

What is wrong with that?

If enough top playes give you anecdotal evidence, it indeed becomes empirical evidence.

And by the way, Summer was number one on the strat 1on1 ladder as much as Gnuff is ladder number one on the RT ladder now.

Not to mention that her second place best rating is better than some best ratings of players you mentioned, that in fact became number one on the ladder.

20: mainly team players who are also good at 1v1s (+ X for his motivational speeches)
apex: mainly 1v1 players who are not as good at team play
wm: in a transition period, from team players to 1v1 players
wg: better at 1v1s than team play
gg: better at 1v1s than team play
lynx: mainly 1v1 players

2v2 ladder is team play designed for 1v1 players. it is team play with training wheels. so results there say as much about strat 1v1 skills as team play. it is a hybrid of the two.

Pulsey, by omission conceded the argument.

I also think XS deserves more credit than you guys give them.

No.

Just no?

Yes.

If we look at 1v1(alts don't count, neither do inactives for 20+ days):

20: 7 #1's, 11 #5+'s, 13 #10+'s (fridge would have reached it if he had ever gotten 15 games), out of 15 total that have tried. 7/15 reached #1, 11/15 top 5, 13/15 top 10.

Apex: 3 #1's, 5 top 5's, 5 top 10's. Out of the 6 active members in their clan (NoobSchool and miyagi have priorities to other clans). 3/6 reached #1, 5/6 top 5, 5/6 top 10.

WG: 2 #1's, 6 top 5's, 8 top 10's. Out of 10 that have tried the ladder. So 2/10 reached #1, 6/10 reached top 5, 8/10 reached top 10.

WM: 4 #1's, 7 top 5's, 8 top 10's. Out of 10 that have tried the ladder. So 4/10 reached #1, 7/10 reached top 5, 8/10 reached top 10.

GG: 4 #1's, 5 top 5's, 6 top 10's. Out of 11 that have tried the ladder. So 4/11 reached #1, 5/11 reached top 5, 6/11 reached top 10.

Lynx: 1 #1, 4 top 5's, 7 top 10's. Out of 13 that have tried the ladder. So 1/13 reached #1, 4/13 reached top 5, 7/13 reached top 10.

Masters: 0#1's, 4 top 5's, 4 top 10's. Out of 12 that have tried the ladder. So 0/12 reached #1, 4/12 reached top 5, 4/12 reached top 10.

XS: 0 #1's, 0 top 5's, 1-2 top 10's (not sure on Oh Noes). Out of 7 that have tried the ladder. So 0/7 reached #1, 0/7 reached top 5, 1-2/7 reached top 10.

AHOL: 3 #1's, 4 top 5's, 5 top 10's. Out of 10 that have tried the ladder. 3/10 #1, 4/10 reached top 5, 5/10 reached top 10.

1. 20
2-3. WM/Apex
4. WG
5. GG
6. AHOL
7. Lynx
8. Masters
9. XS

20>Apex=WM. Half of Apex has taken #1. But they have only 6 active players. WM has had more players attempt the ladder, and more of each category than Apex. But they also have a lower percentage in each category than Apex. Depth + Average skill should both be included. Apex wins on average skill; WM wins on depth.

WG>GG. GG had more #1's. But remember how they kept dropping out for each other and Oliebol had to stall a lot? WG shows more depth with less players.

2v2 Ladder:

20: 10/14 reached #1.
Apex: 4/6 reached #1.
WG: 3/9 reached #1.
AHOL: 1/10 reached #1.
XS: 0/7 reached #1.
Lynx: 3/9 reached #1.
Master: 0/10 reached #1.
GG: 2/10 reached #1.
WM: 4/10 reached #1.

Standings for 2v2:
1. 20
2. Apex
3. WM
4. Lynx/WG
6. GG
7. AHOL
8. Master/XS

Combined at Medium Earth:
1. 20
2. Apex
3. WM
4. WG
5. GG
6. Lynx
7. AHOL
8. Masters
9. XS

Team games can only be determined from experience. My personal opinion of these clans on team games in general:
1. 20
2. WM
3. WG
4. Apex
5. GG
6. Lynx
7. Masters
8. AHOL
9. XS

I think without a doubt, 20 has to be considered the most skilled clan. 2nd would be either Apex or WM, with WG being a very close 4th. 5th is GG; 6th is Lynx with Masters close behind in 7th and AHOL close behind in 8th. After that, there is a big drop off, but XS is arguably 9th.

it's somehow stupid that you measure a Clans skill after how many Players took #1 in the 1vs1 ladder. like that you reward stallers and guys who do only ladder runs of 15 games who would never be #1 otherwise.