The Islamics torture for the very same reason as the US does: To get info. The Islamics torture as much for fun as the US does (not very much, although a little).

Torture is not the answer, and I'm almost sure it was the US who tortured people first. Have you considered, by your logic, that the Islamics are trying to make it right?

slammy, I think generalisations are ok, since people like skourby stand out more than people like you. So long as they're recognised as generalisations and stereotypes.

Muslims have been torturing people for longer than the US has existed.

Жұқтыру i agree that sometimes generalizations are okay. my point was that myhand should not be allowed to make them. he revoked his generalization rights when he criticized others for doing it.

ah fuck it

Edited 1/8/2015 14:23:04

Ok, well torture has existed longer than perhaps civilisation, I'm talking about in modern times. In the 80s, I believe the central Middle East was pretty peaceful externally, but when the 90s came along, with the Gulf War, where a coalition of several countries all dogpiled on Iraq (I wonder why?), with the US spearheading it, US, although not torturing people, did broadcast on Iraqi television several mutilated bodies after they bombed a civilian bunker and killed around 400 people. Fast forward to Iraqi war, there are much more cases of human rights abuse on US/UK side rather than Iraqi side.

@Жұқтыру, Google the Iran-Iraq War. I'd say the central Middle East was not all that peaceful in the 80s.

But the main point is that torture ought to be roundly condemned by all civilized people, regardless of who is doing it, and regardless of why.

Edited 1/8/2015 15:02:20

*externally*

The only time when torture is acceptable is to fight fire with fire.

The methods used by the U.S barely qualify as torture compared to what's done by organizations like AL-Qaeda. Secondly, when you have a confirmed terrorist who's part of a plot to kill hundreds of innocents, how do you get information? Ask him nicely? But I digress, you guys are right. People who murder dozens of innocents without a second thought are still people and deserve full rights, we should treat them with respect and not try and force them to do anything they don't want to.

P.S: Why the heck is this in the general forum? How is this related to Warlight in the slightest?

It's time to end the disastrous democratic experiment.

*Doffs fedora*

But what about the people who have been detained and tortured simply because of a case of mistaken identity? In the Senate report there was one case of an innocent man being tortured to death. How is that even remotely justifiable?

Also, there is really no consensus that torture is actually useful in getting information. There is actually some evidence that maintaining a respectful attitude towards prisoners and attempting to find common ground is more effective in this regard.

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/12/the-humane-interrogation-technique-that-works-much-better-than-torture/383698/

Beren is very right. Also, torture is used to find out possible hidden information, but not definite hidden information. Such is even more unforgivable.

Жұқтыру: When does this arbitrary "Modern times" you speak of start? Neither party in the American - Middle-Eastern conflict tortured the other one first. It's frustrating when people like you phrase events as if the US went into Iraq completely unprovoked, as if Saddam was just a nice guy minding his own business of flowers and rainbows. You can't pit the blame of half-a-century of conflict entirely on one party - it's utterly foolish. That's an example of a generalization that's not okay.

Edited 1/8/2015 19:13:20

It's the ciiiiiiircle of striiiiiiiiife. And it kills us alllllllll. Through despair, and more despaaaaaiiiiiir. Through death and paiiiiiiiiinnnnn. Til we nuke ourselllllllllvvvvveeess, into total extinctioooooooooon. It's the ciiiiiirrrrcccccllllleleeee, the circle oooo-fffff striiiiiiiiiiiife!

^pretty catchy IMO

Edited 1/8/2015 19:25:38

Yea, I'm sure that when we stop torturing them, they will stop torturing innocents. I'm also sure of the fact that when we finally stop being involved in the Middle East, they won't attack us anymore.
(Sarcasm)

Edited 1/8/2015 21:57:31

as if the US went into Iraq completely unprovoked, as if Saddam was just a nice guy minding his own business of flowers and rainbows.

Those, who create monsters are in charge to eliminate them and terrorize an entire nation for the benefit of oil profits.

How is that even remotely justifiable?

Beren, your question remind me on a joke: what do you do when you accidently hunt and kill a cow? You put a rabbit into its mouth and say the cow was poaching.

Anyhow, there will never be a reason, that justifies torture! Even if it was for informations, you will never have a garuantee if those informations are true. Those methods have been outdated hundreds of years ago and belong into the middle ages, as well as post executive condemnation after assassinations, which is practiced and allowed in the USA, too. Á la: kill them first and ask them afterwards. Those and similar medieval methods and political practices set american politics on a similar level like those hillbilly nations. Unfortunately you could be much better than this!

EDIT:

when we finally stop being involved in the Middle East, they won't attack us anymore.(Sarcasm)

Skourby. Why should they continue? and which attacks do you exactly mean?

Edited 1/9/2015 01:23:44

oh nothing big. maybe like crashing into the world trade center, holding hostages in Sydney, and beheading journalists. Nothing that would kill anyone amiright?

also, im not saying that we should have entered the war. im saying we should finish it

Skourby, you are the epitome of the american stereotype, stop trying to justify torture. It's unlawful, and not useful in any way because just about anyone being tortured would confess to something just to make it stop.

Yeah now I remember why I quit forum arguments in the first place - people are utterly close-minded and don't really read anything that anyone else says, and I'm not at all just talking about my post. Have fun with the flame war guys.