Point in favor of Flex: The average number of games per day per clan will increase now, because more than 40 players per clan can play (anyone can play), so this concern is likely to affect more clans than it would've within the rules with slot cap.

I am surprised Fizzer wants to make skill more relevant.
He always wanted CW to be activity contest.

So this is the biggest surprise to me.


50 player clans instead of 40 means bigger clans which also is the opposite of what Fizzer wanted.

Edited 8/21/2024 14:44:18

I think this is quite close to being a great CW update. My only suggestion would be to tweak the points such that everyone can play but only the top 25 at the end of *the season* count.

In the proposed system, players are disincentivized to play if they are the 26th best player in their clan. If Clan Wars truly is for Everyone, we should be incentivizing everyone to play, always.

That would be a great alteration to what I wrote above! (Edit: I mean in a positive way, it would solve the problem mine had)

Edited 8/21/2024 14:50:02

End of season is still bad cause it means top 25 have to play every day but only 26-50 can play when they want.

Top 25 you try to get easy games while the rest goes to hunt main opponents and make sure not to be top 25 :)

for a long time clan caps was an issue in cw specifically. fizzer is increasing the cap but also removing the system that made it a problem in the first place so how is a cap increase beneficial now?

Not sure about the cap thing but I hope all clans can have same amount of members in general.
Not only for CW but for community.

increased to 50. it one on the first items in the list if updates

If we care only about CW rewards, then we are incentivised to all join two mega clans to always get first and second place rewards in cw

thats not true riskyboy.

if you join a megaclan that gets 25 wins (very optimistic) every 50 games daily, that translates to 0.5 points per win, which would net you in this season for example at approximately 137.5 points, aka 4th place.

With those stats if you look at the stats of some more competitive seasons, like around seasons 35-40, you are looking at 5th, 6th place in clan wars at best with a mega clan.

And thats if the mega clan can have 50% wr of 25 wins in 50 games...

What do you mean? there are only 2 clans in this scenario, so we all get 1st and 2nd only. there is no such thing as 5th.

every single person gets either 1st or second.

Edited 8/21/2024 15:06:56

you heavily imply 3 things:
1) the total number of players interested in clan wars are <100
2) everyone compromises into playing for only 2 clans
3) every other clan in existence is destroyed for the sake of idle rewards, a game thats not even the focus of clan wars

its not going to happen but i'm just pointing out this is the incentive *assuming* we only all care about idle rewards.

1. uncapped clans exist, so there is no restriction at 100.
2. that's what will happen *assuming* we only want idle rewards
3. *assuming* most or all of us only want idle rewards, this is what is happening

Edited 8/21/2024 15:10:53

well what is most likely going to happen is that even an idle clan will not accept you if you only lose games

which incentivises even idlers to learn hot to play some classic templates, even if it is sead

Not sure this is going to do much to the stratification and therefore motivation to play more.

If I managed a clan whose best 25-30 players were top 10 capable, I would restrict participation to those because it would otherwise dilute the per-player coin rewards and win points, since they are maximized at [Win rate * 25].

If I managed a 11th-20th clan, I would not care about participation because there are no coins to gain, we only get idle rewards per person. And adding daily players [even if there is a marginal over replacement level out there somewhere] gains nothing after the 25th.

If I managed a 21st+ place clan, the only thing to get are the clan territory idle rewards, and so more players again buys us very little.

As a hypothetical clan manager, I have trivial, zero, or negative benefit to letting the 26th person play, continuing for each subsequent player. More so if I believe the clan finishing positions are close to locked in [reinforced by CWR and scarce talent].

I have significant reservations regarding the hypothesis that this will increase participation.

Luckily for us, this hypothesis will be easy to prove or disprove :)

I want to start by saying that I'm really glad Fizzer is listening to suggestions, and an update to Clan Wars has been needed for a long time so I'm happy to see it! I think starting seasons on a new day is an unambiguous improvement, and I appreciate lifting the 40-player clan cap a little bit - I didn't think Fizzer was willing to do that.

My problem with the update is that there's now a direct incentive NOT to play sometimes. And it's not just the edge case where a team goes 25 for 25. I have a roughly 63% winrate in CW (nearly all my games on this account are CW games). My clan's winrate this season is currently 73%. So any day that I don't make an early slot, and I show up to a late slot to see that my clan has won 18 out of 25 games (which will be about average), I shouldn't play. Furthermore, if my team really wants to optimize, I should wait for a late slot before playing to see whether 25 better players get a game that day or not.

To be fair, it may be rare that a clan gets 25 games in before the last slot or two (although with 50 players now eligible to play, this gets easier!), and I see the argument that this only affects a few clans.

I think I'll reserve judgment until I see how things play out. Maybe it'll be kind of nice to get some days off.

Next let's introduce some template rotation!

Edited 8/21/2024 16:00:02

"increased to 50. it one on the first items in the list if updates"

I guess you answered me but did you?

Since I did talk about the fairness of clans building communities.

Will everyone now have a cap of 50 members?

If so its fair.
If some clans dont have that limit of members nothing is fixed and new clans should aim to get to old clans.
This kill motivation for some that started something and then just realise its unfair and they quit or move to old clan.

If Fizzer really did want to remove the advantage that bigger clans got, why not keep the scoring the same, but split the larger clans/more-active clans into A teams, B teams, C teams, etc?

Edited 8/21/2024 16:51:46