The rating of his 3rd profile is most probably his true rating in my opinion.

Yeah, kasse84 should be the top scorer of the leaderboard imo, since he is not "unbeatable" like the other guys.

https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=15461445

Edited 9/28/2021 17:11:40

lol. Why are you thinking so highly of yourself? I assure you that his true rating would be hundreads of points ahead of you. Stop being a jealous a**hole and accept the truth that he is better than you. FYI, you dont get a prize or anything(not even a trophy) if you are first in QM so just keep that in mind. Many good players dont even play QM so even if you are 1st in QM, that wouldnt mean that you are the GOAT of SE. That would just mean that you are a person who activily plays QM and wins more than 85% of his games.

Where do you draw the line as for the rating from which on you accuse the player of cheating by trying to get matchups against their alts? Like, take as granted that we ignore the completely illogical aspect that following this thought, he would be giving rating to two of his accounts, not one. I guess 70-80% of the top 100 players have at least one alt. Are they all cheaters or just a couple?

Simple question, Ercole. Had you ever faced Ozijs or any of his alts? If yes, then what is your personal score against him?

I can personally admit that sometimes I am scouting possible top opponents when playing my favourite templates, like MME Commanders. If any of those people are online, I am pressing Play more willingly, cause winning them is the only way for me to get more then 1 point per win, along with getting an actually good game. My guess, Ozijs can think in the same way towards you or any other decent rated person in SE. Is this forbidden?

I am just 1-0 Vs his 3rd

Link please.

@Ercole
What QM leaderboard are you referring to?

Regarding whether we can prove that he's not cheating - that's not how it works. You as the accuser have to prove that he is cheating, not simply accuse and have him (or someone else on his behalf) prove that he's not. Playing QM with an alt vs others isn't cheating. Gathering intel whether it be from communication with others, scouting using alts, etc, isn't cheating. Is your reason for suspicion simply that he has a high rating & a few alts that also play QM?

To be clear, I have no idea if he's playing QM games of main vs alts, but in lieu of evidence showing that it's actually happening, I'm certainly not going to accuse him of it. If you have no evidence yourself, why even pursue this idea?

sorry I was wrong, I played only with his 5th account (how many damned accounts does he have?) https://www.warzone.com/Profile?p=17139346510

https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=27011650
This one seems active so I mailed him too.

@krinid I am talking of the Quickmatch's SE1W leaderboard

I repeat myself again: the simple fact that he uses so many smurfs is an issue by itself, no matter if he uses them even to try to smash our ratings or to cheat in other ways like scouting or direct feeding to help his main.

Edited 9/28/2021 18:35:06

OHHH my bad, I didn't know there was one! But now that you mention it, I went looking for it and found it. lol

Is there a better interface for it than the multi-tabbed view from the QM game interface itself? One with user searches or at least lists all players on 1 page?

playing with ALTs in the same 1v1 competition of your main = high possibility to cheat.

As long as no 2 accounts request games at the same time, you will never get paired up with each other. If you believe he played himself, report his account with that game linked in the report and a moderator will take action against the cheating.

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Dude just stfu if you dont know shit. If you got the guts, then play bo11 with him. He is one of the best SE players and this fact is accepted by most of the sensible unbiased people who arnt assholes like you..... You are the first person in wz to accuse a player without any proof just because you are jealous of his rating. I mean the top 2 ranks of SE1W leaderboard are occupied by him.

Very polite of you Arrow, I'm sure you mother is proud of you. Also, why would you use 2 posts to post a single message in the forum?

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What I am asking myself now is: how can you all be that sure that he didn't?

His rating is a complete outlier data, I don't know how wonderful is he in game but with a rating like that in a temp like SE1W and so many accounts I don't get your thoughts at all. Do you think that we are all idiots except him?

If Fizzer has to assume everyone with alts is cheating in QM, he can ban half of WZ. I (and probably most people) operate on the principle that everyone in innocent until proven guilty, so I'll just assume he didnt cheat until someone proves me he did.

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Firstly, Quickmatch isnt a competition. Its just for fun casual rt/md games. You dont get a trophy if you are first in QM

It is a competition, with leaderboards and achievements. You dont get rewards besides the achievements, so cheating doesnt get you much.

---

I repeat myself again: the simple fact that he uses so many smurfs is an issue by itself, no matter if he uses them even to try to smash our ratings or to cheat in other ways like scouting or direct feeding to help his main.

I dont see the problem as long as he doenst abuse his alts. I also have multiple accounts that played 1 to 5 QM games on SEAD, that only played QM cause you need to be lvl 4 to post on forums.

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Is there a better interface for it than the multi-tabbed view from the QM game interface itself? One with user searches or at least lists all players on 1 page?

No, you can look at your Template QM page to see your own rating, and then use your rating to get close-ish to the page you are listed on.

@SerFen Scouting can be used to avoid being matched with strong players in order to feed your main with weak players after you have seen that there are not high rated ones to be matched with using your alt, the exact opposite of what you are saying.

Once you have cheated enough it doesn't matter if you opponent has 1000 or 200 of rating, you gain always 1 point from your game.

@JK_3 He is in the top of the leaderboard with 4-5 (Who the hell knows how many?) accounts that most probably feed each other. If that's not an issue for you all I am going to bring my alt too and you can't know if it is feeding my main so I am innocent until you show me a link of my cheating since we are all innocents without proofs and this message isn't a proof.

...

do you want QMs to become like that?

...

Edited 9/28/2021 19:29:52

@Ercole
Let's say I agree with your logic partially. Like, it is possible to use alts in the way you describe. Still, without links to the corrupted games your accusations are not valid. Guilty needs to be proven.

I fear that we will start to block the best players simply because they are the best. In the system where accusations alone are enough and no other evidence is required, we will soon have literally no active community. Do you want WZ to become like that?

Also, I still don't see how any person, no matter how many alts he use, could beat a superior in skill and relatively active player. This player will regularly win a lot of points from all those alts and if he eventually meet the main account of the so called “cheater”, this will be a complete disaster for the latter. Yes, cheater can get high in the rating, but will easily become the feeder himself to a person whom he simply can't beat in the open field.

Playing against yourself is rule-breaking, but having multiple accounts on QM (afaict) isn't. Do you have evidence that Ozi has played against his alts?

Barring that, many players have used QM with alts (including several moderators[1]). QM uses the TrueSkill rating system so there's not much opportunity for abuse without directly playing yourself, unlike the 1v1 ladder. Also, it's QM. The ratings are there mainly for matchmaking and virtually no one takes it seriously as a competitive event. The impact of manipulating QM ratings is so low that it's realistically not worth caring about. If you couldn't multi-account on QM, that would take away one of the best avenues for leveling up an alt (and also be pretty hard to enforce, since it would require automating multi-account detection to work at scale or otherwise create a lot of moderation load for an already-overwhelmed team).

There's already a built-in punishment: the penalty for cheating in QM is being the sort of person that would care enough about QM rating to cheat at QM. Even a perma-ban is a drop in the bucket compared to that level of shame.

Ozi, if you ever play him, is legitimately one of the very best players on SE. So he also gets near-zero utility out of inflating his QM rating.

1: https://www.warzone.com/Profile?p=35127482809, https://www.warzone.com/Profile?p=31105111944 for example

Edited 9/29/2021 00:47:30

@Ercole

do you want QMs to become like that?

I think what we're kind of asking here is ... what do you want QMs to be like? Some gets accused, and it's now up to him to prove he's innocent, else ... some type of punishment occurs? Account gets banned? And what would constitute proof of non-cheating? Does he have to list every game he's every played? How does a player prove that all the accounts he's ever played against are not his alts?

I'm not trolling here, it's a serious question - hypothetically assuming that there is cheating going on, how do you propose to solve this problem you've described?

literally this forum is useless.
a.almost no one cares about QM ratings and
B. Assuming this guy is cheating,and does not deserve the rating he has.. Just ask to 1v1 him on SE if you are so confident.PROVE he's not as good as his rating shows.

Edited 9/29/2021 03:35:17

@JK_3 He is in the top of the leaderboard with 4-5 (Who the hell knows how many?) accounts that most probably feed each other. If that's not an issue for you all I am going to bring my alt too and you can't know if it is feeding my main so I am innocent until you show me a link of my cheating since we are all innocents without proofs and this message isn't a proof.

...

do you want QMs to become like that?

About 20% of the top 100 global leaderboards is an alt. QM has been like that for a long time. Just having alts in QM doesn't mean you're cheating or playing against yourself. If you're accusing someone of that then you're going to have to bring proof.

Feeding yourself with your alts is, most likely, not worth the hassle. There's very limited control over who you match up against, so you'd have to keep both of your accounts at the top to make the chance of a direct matchup as big as possible. However, one of your accounts will constantly lose and take the hit for the other, meaning you constantly have to play randoms just to stay on top with that account. Effectively you have to legitimately become first with one account just so it can feed your other account. You have to do this with the handicap of always losing against your other account and constantly taking hits, meaning you have less room to lose against the randos if you want to keep your 91% win rate up.

EDIT: It also feels like you're slightly mistaken. While QM ratings give a rough estimate of one's skill it is mainly an indicator of activity and how many games one has played. Most players in the Strat community are able to maintain at least an 85% win rate and a lot will be towards or over the 91% required to keep your rating rising. At that point, it's just about how many games you're willing to play. A lot of the players in the top 150 could probably make it into the top 15 if they really wanted to. It's just a lot of work (generally only rising 1 rating per win) and just not worth it. Its much more fun to keep it casual.

Edited 9/29/2021 06:57:49

So you're saying that, if Ozi actually did cheat to get to the top of the QM leaderboard, that's actually more impressive than getting to the top normally?

If he's trying to keep two accounts on top, whilst feeding his 1st account with his 2nd account it's at least more work. It gives the main account a higher rating, but makes it more difficult for the 2nd account to stay in 2nd. Unless there's hidden mechanics that I'm not aware of :D

@Serfen Even if the method does not work 1 time every 100 games you have still gained 90 points in those 100 games so if you are already between the best players like he is (never denied it), that makes you the top scorer of the leaderboard with your main "undisputed god", a thing that sucks a lot.

@krind it seems that here they are shaming me for accusing him, not him for cheating...

@jman as I have shown in my previous messages I have already beaten him on his alt and that is between the main reasons why I think he's a cheater and it's not possible that he reached that huge rating without playing against his alts.

@Min34 it is not worth it but he did it the same just to flex in the leaderboard, if noone is going to block him or his alts I don't see why I should not do the same to dispute the "undisputed god".

Just to make this clear once again, accusing someone of cheating without any evidence is an absolutely pathetic thing to do, mildly speaking.